Tiny Hard Drives Offer Big Storage

[Jason Dunn]

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,113796,tk,dn120803X,00.asp' target='_blank'>http://www.pcworld.com/news/article...n120803X,00.asp</a><br /><br /></div>"The growing demand for low-cost, high-capacity, and compact storage for mobile devices is pushing development of small form-factor hard drives and the first of a new generation of sub-1-inch drives should hit the market in 2004. One of the first companies to show a sub-1-inch hard drive is expected to be Japan's Toshiba. The company plans to show a sample drive product at the CES show that takes place in Las Vegas in January 2004, it said Monday.<br /><br />Toshiba wouldn't provide any further details about the drive although industry sources say that Toshiba and several other companies, including Matsu****a Kotobuki Electronics Industries, are working on development of drives with 0.8-inch or 0.7-inch diameter platters. That's smaller than the CompactFlash form-factor Microdrive produced by Hitachi, which is based on a 1-inch platter, and less than half the size of the 1.8-inch drive used in Apple Computer's IPod portable music player..."<br /><br />I'm generally pessimistic about the idea of putting a moving hard drive in a Pocket PC (likely because I had an IBM Microdrive fail on me), but there seems to be a lot of positive momentum moving in the direction of integrating mass storage in portable devices. I wasn't a big believer in this until I saw the Rio Nitrus player, which has a 1.5 GB hard drive in it - and you have to assume Rio wouldn't release a portable MP3 player unless they knew it was fairly sturdy. So, who knows - we might see a Pocket PC with integrated hard disk-based storage on it in the near future...

[Dazbot]

They would have to be efficient, my 2210 only last about 5 1/2 hours at best, if it had a hdd built in I'd hate to think how long the battery would last.

[Wasp]

I tried the microdrive for a while. That sucking sound was the sound of the current being drawn from my battery. 8)

[corphack]

These mini-drives should be a novelty item; unfortunately they're positioned as serious system hardware.

They seem like a step backwards: the goal of machines is to have no moving parts. Even Plato realized this, way back when.

Every so often a magazine will run an article about this Japanese engineer who makes miniature metal mice with a mini-metal motor. The whole thing is about the size of a US dime. His employer permits this because he is considered a national living art treasure, and because they make digital watches where the skills involved in the miniaturization of clockworks lends itself to other applications (nanotechnology).

Micro-miniaturized hard drives is a technological dead-end: it is only usefull as a marketing feature, and in the development of manufacturing skills that can be applied elsewhere. From the consumer's point of view, it offers nothing: it generates heat and component wear which degrades the entire unit overtime. This becomes especially poinient since Toshiba has already announced that they consider such products as "disposable", and they do not warrantee "disposable" products. Do we really want to store our data on such devices?

[Christian]

I use a 1 GB Microdrive in my 2210 almost all the time, and I can't say I've seen a measurable drop in battery life. I've tried testing it both ways and the difference is in the noise level. Personally I've been waiting for Pocket PCs with integrated hard drives.

Maybe I just don't find 64 MB of combined RAM & storage space exciting. Or 128, or even 256. How about 1 or 2 GB instead? 8)

[corphack]

How about 1 or 2 GB instead

I'd prefer that they do it with high quality, dense RAM / ROM chips. RAM is dirt cheap, and a mature technology.

I've already learned my lessons from being an early adopter of other, immature Toshiba products (never again!).

[Christian]

Do we really want to store our data on such devices?

Frankly, my iPaq has lost all of its memory more than once already due to hard resetting itself (at nearly full power too). :roll: My previous Toshiba did this regularly. My Microdrive on the other hand, which I have now used in two digital cameras and three Pocket PCs for over a year and a half, has never lost a byte. So yes, I would definately want to store my data on such devices, if they were much larger and/or cheaper than existing flash media. As an example, I bought my Microdrive at less than a quarter of the price of an equally sized CF card at the time.

[Christian]

How about 1 or 2 GB instead

I'd prefer that they do it with high quality, dense RAM / ROM chips. RAM is dirt cheap, and a mature technology.

I've already learned my lessons from being an early adopter of other, immature Toshiba products (never again!).

I agree completely about immature Toshiba products (see many rants :wink: ) But I disagree concerning RAM versus HD in general. Even today, desktop RAM costs more than 1 inch hard drives do per MB, even ignoring the size. More relevantly, flash memory is sadly not dirt cheap - AFAIK, 1 GB flash memory of a comparable size to these new drives doesn't even exist yet, never mind in a mature state.

[corphack]

Frankly, my iPaq has lost all of its memory more than once already due to hard resetting itself (at nearly full power too). My previous Toshiba did this regularly

I don't understand: are you saying that your data was lost because the storage within your PPCs failed, or because the PPCs themselves failed?

My IBM Microdrive is also still going strong after 2 years; it may be significant that IBM has abandoned further development of the microdrives. My Mr. Flash and SanDisk CF, Lexar, SanDisk, and Kingston SD cards have also never lost a byte, and I'm not especially worried about them because they have no internal moving parts.

I just really have an issue with machines evolving to have more and more moving parts: more things to break.

Memory cards have no issues with friction, and they only draw power (and generate heat) when I'm accessing them. The microdrives spin constantly.

Like humans, hard drives begin wearing down as soon as they are turned on. Unlike humans, hard drives don't heal.

[Christian]

Frankly, my iPaq has lost all of its memory more than once already due to hard resetting itself (at nearly full power too). My previous Toshiba did this regularly

I don't understand: are you saying that your data was lost because the storage within your PPCs failed, or because the PPCs themselves failed?

My IBM Microdrive is also still going strong after 2 years; it may be significant that IBM has abandoned further development of the microdrives. My Mr. Flash and SanDisk CF, Lexar, SanDisk, and Kingston SD cards have also never lost a byte, and I'm not especially worried about them because they have no internal moving parts.

I just really have an issue with machines evolving to have more and more moving parts: more things to break.

Memory cards have no issues with friction, and they only draw power (and generate heat) when I'm accessing them. The microdrives spin constantly.

Like humans, hard drives begin wearing down as soon as they are turned on. Unlike humans, hard drives don't heal.

I lost my data because the PPC failed (I'm guessing), but I don't believe it could have formatted a hard drive as easily. For the record, I have had two flash memory cards irreparably break, (Sandisk CF and SD) but that may just have been bad luck. I understand that hard drives have moving parts and can wear down, but that doesn't need to be a problem. I have also never lost a byte on the more than dozen PC hard drives I've used over the years. Besides, there are other considerations at work. If you get me a 5 GB SD card for $50 we wouldn't need to talk about miniature hard drives :lol:

[burtman007]

They can make them as small as a needle head, but if they are still slow to access, what's the point?

From the desktop/server arena, we all know that a majority of system bottlenecks occur at the "physical" HD level. Why take a step back and introduce that into a quick access platform like PDAs???

[GoldKey]

I don't really NEED GB of data accessible at all times on my PDA. What I would like is an external HD (like my DJ) to be able to talk to my Axim either via a cable or wirelessly. And it can't be super expensive.

[yslee]

Do we really want to store our data on such devices?

Frankly, my iPaq has lost all of its memory more than once already due to hard resetting itself (at nearly full power too). :roll: My previous Toshiba did this regularly. My Microdrive on the other hand, which I have now used in two digital cameras and three Pocket PCs for over a year and a half, has never lost a byte. So yes, I would definately want to store my data on such devices, if they were much larger and/or cheaper than existing flash media. As an example, I bought my Microdrive at less than a quarter of the price of an equally sized CF card at the time.

This is a rather skewed comparison, no? If you had stored your data on a CF/SD/whatever card, chances are it'll still be there, like those in your microdrive. And microdrives are not the most sturdy things on this planet.

And I'll bet if you managed to apply a current all the way to your iPAQ's RAM, the data could still be retrived, though how exactly is beyond me.

I personally don't mind these drives if they're cheap for storage of non critical files (mp3s like those in the Rio and the Creative). But I'd really rather not have one of these in my next PDA!

[Marcel_Proust]

Do we really want to store our data on such devices?

Frankly, my iPaq has lost all of its memory more than once already due to hard resetting itself (at nearly full power too). :roll: My previous Toshiba did this regularly. My Microdrive on the other hand, which I have now used in two digital cameras and three Pocket PCs for over a year and a half, has never lost a byte. So yes, I would definately want to store my data on such devices, if they were much larger and/or cheaper than existing flash media. As an example, I bought my Microdrive at less than a quarter of the price of an equally sized CF card at the time.

This is a rather skewed comparison, no? If you had stored your data on a CF/SD/whatever card, chances are it'll still be there, like those in your microdrive. And microdrives are not the most sturdy things on this planet.

And I'll bet if you managed to apply a current all the way to your iPAQ's RAM, the data could still be retrived, though how exactly is beyond me.

I personally don't mind these drives if they're cheap for storage of non critical files (mp3s like those in the Rio and the Creative). But I'd really rather not have one of these in my next PDA!

A fascinating method to retrieve data lost form RAM. Running a current to your iPAQ's RAM. Could you tell me more about this idea - it sounds very intriguing!

My 2 cents: Theoretically, I too would have thought my 1gb IBM Microdrive should be less reliable, but oddly has been more reliable, than 3, Viking, Sandisk, and a noname brand of CF solid state cards I've had.....so go figure!

[jnunn]

So, who knows - we might see a Pocket PC with integrated hard disk-based storage on it in the near future...
I would never purchase a PPC with an integrated HD regardless of the other attributes of the PPC. I could see shrinking the HD platter to one day accommodate an SD form factor but integration into the PPC itself seems too rife with perception and warranty problems.

[GoldKey]

A fascinating method to retrieve data lost form RAM. Running a current to your iPAQ's RAM. Could you tell me more about this idea - it sounds very intriguing!


Actually this is possible. I was at an auditing conference a few weeks ago and we were discussing doing audits of surplussed computers to see if all data had actually been removed from the hard disks. The presenter mentioned that they had actually been able to read data from the RAM of computers that had been powered off and in storage for months. I thought this would be impossible, but the presenter was a pretty well respected auditor with lots of experience in this area.

[SassKwatch]

Besides, there are other considerations at work. If you get me a 5 GB SD card for $50 we wouldn't need to talk about miniature hard drives :lol:

Amen! I'd even take the 5gb SD over the Microdrive (or other mini-hd) if offered at the *same* price. But for what you would pay for a 5gb SD (or even CF) card......? "Fuhgedaboudit!"

I've used my MD for approx 1.5 yr now.....in 3 different PPC's and a digital camera....all with nary a burp.

And you can tell me all day long about the decreased battery life. But for the price difference, you can buy *at least* one extra battery for your ppc. And that's assuming you feel the need. Maybe my usage hasn't been typical, but the batt drain in my devices with a MD vs that with a CF or SD card just hasn't been that significant.

[jeffmd]

lol, rio is KING of "re-lable it and forget about it" hardware. They support alot of new stuff, but dont expect updates/future support. I thank god that my rio 250 mp3cd excepts the firmware from the iriver 250's (Thats the player the rio250 is a re-lable of)