Force-fed MS Reader update ... be afraid, very afraid.

[davidspalding]

Posted by welwyngc (http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=530404) over at Brighthand:

... MS have just announced that there is an update to Reader.

However, as far as i can see, the update only relates to DRM - no other changes / improvements made

A little cheeky?


http://www.microsoft.com/reader/default.asp

AND..

A Note To Our Valued Customers

June 26, 2003: Today we are announcing the rollout of a Microsoft Reader security update. This system-wide update closes known gaps in the Microsoft Reader security architecture. The “trigger” for the update is the purchase and/or downloading of a digitally protected Owner Exclusive Microsoft Reader eBook title. When you purchase a new title, or re-download a previously purchased title, after June 30th you will be prompted to update your system. The update consists of two steps: an update of your device’s client software and the re-activation of your reading system(s). We have developed a new update/activation site that will help you determine the steps necessary to download the appropriate software for your device(s) and re-activate your system(s). You can wait until you receive an update prompt or perform the update now by visiting www.microsoft.com/reader/update. The new system will be fully deployed at the beginning of July.

We recognize that this update is an inconvenience and appreciate your continued support for Microsoft Reader. This security update will help ensure that publishers continue to make their newest and best content available to you in the Microsoft Reader format.

Thank you for choosing Microsoft Reader!

The Microsoft Reader Team

(emphasis added)


And this for PPC's (PPC2002 and for PPC2003 (MS wording!))

http://www.microsoft.com/reader/downloads/ppc.asp


It sure sounds like MS is waging war on Convert-LIT. The idea of forced upgrades just to use something you've previously bought makes me feel icky.

Also ... I don't seem to hear anything about backwards compatibility of DRM5 secure books. Do we just cross our fingers and click, hoping that MIcrosoft won't bung us?

I hereby volunteer Crystal to get the skinny on this new development. Go git 'em, girl! Counting on you to tell it like it is....

[dean_shan]

Does this fix the memory leak problem or what?

[dhettel]

Looks like it is just a security update. Nothing more.

David

[Crystal Eitle]

I hereby volunteer Crystal to get the skinny on this new development. Go git 'em, girl! Counting on you to tell it like it is....

Sounds like you already got the skinny :D . This sure is irritating. Is MS trying to purposefully alienate its customers? I really like the way Reader looks; that's why I use it. But if the DRM stuff gets too annoying, I'll switch to another format. I hear Palm Reader is good....

[Janak Parekh]

I have to say, in my opinion, this is a pretty reasonable thing for MS to do. Not that I like DRM by any means, but honestly, should they just sit back and let people crack DRM5-protected LIT files? Do you have a better suggestion (short of gutting the current e-book industry architecture or gutting MS's whole model from the ground up)?

--janak

[ChristopherTD]

I have to say, in my opinion, this is a pretty reasonable thing for MS to do. Not that I like DRM by any means, but honestly, should they just sit back and let people crack DRM5-protected LIT files?

I guess if we are still able to read all the books we have already purchased then it is a non-issue. If the old books need to be re-issued then that could be a problem if the original vendor is no longer in existence.

Hopefully some brave soul will try the "patch" and report back on the effect on existing content.

[Jorgen]

>should they just sit back and let people crack DRM5-protected LIT files?

Frankly, yes - They should close their eyes and pretend that it does not happen. After all not that many have a program that can convert LIT files.

Most popular paper-books are OCR'ed into ebooks. I understand that even the Harry Potter book was available within a week after the formal publication date. According to a director from Fictionwise (I think), the illegal copies are scanned, not illegal copies of ebooks - one would have thought they would find some of their own unprotected ebooks, but apparently not. The Potter book does anyway not exist as an ebook and if this can arrive in days, DRM-schemes of any kind is just a nuissance for the customer. Personally, I generally stick to ebooks, I can convert to ASCII/HTML (Fictionwise unprotected ebooks) so I can be sure that I can read them 10-20 years from now. I would certainly not buy formats like .LIT that expects me to have a MS PPC the rest of my days.

Jorgen

[davidspalding]

I have to say, in my opinion, this is a pretty reasonable thing for MS to do. Not that I like DRM by any means, but honestly, should they just sit back and let people crack DRM5-protected LIT files? Do you have a better suggestion (short of gutting the current e-book industry architecture or gutting MS's whole model from the ground up)?

--janak

I'm not under the impression that this is a widespread problem. Maybe there's a raging P2P community swapping hundreds of cracked books that the press haven't reported on. But I haven't heard a peep about it.

My alternative ... it's not mine ... the OEBPS ... it's needs a DRM wrapper standard ... and I hope that someone's working on that.
____________

I can understand if MS and others are selling publishers on the fear that their books are going to be pirated unless they buy into MS' proprietary and "secure" ebook format ... even if it means users are going to have to upgrade over and over and over again. I'm sure Microsoft paints a lovely, glossy picture of users effortlessly updating their PCs and PPCs every year or so to keep up with the fear vaccine.

But there is a point of diminishing returns when users are so over-burdened with updates and patches and obsolescence that they won't be customers for that format.

Frankly, PDM and Mobipocket are NOT having the "problem" that MS is having. And I prefer those formats anyway. The only reason that I buy MS Secure .LIT files is when I have to, and the only reason I crack them is so that I can read them on my device. I have no such problems with other eBook formats.

What I fear ... is the Quicktime syndrome, in which progressively newer and neater versions of the player software no longer plays older media. The user gets skewered with the "choice" of access to the newest media and being unable to play old media, or the inverse. Yuck.

[Janak Parekh]

Frankly, yes - They should close their eyes and pretend that it does not happen. After all not that many have a program that can convert LIT files.
I'm not under the impression that this is a widespread problem. Maybe there's a raging P2P community swapping hundreds of cracked books that the press haven't reported on. But I haven't heard a peep about it.
It's not a matter of the fact that the problem will have very little practical effect; it's a matter of convincing publishers to adopt their technology. David, I think it works in the opposite direction: publishers ask Microsoft, "why should we bother?" and Microsoft has to demonstrate a security model that works before books get converted into electronic form. With a known security hole out there, no publisher that is convinced DRM5 is the way to go will use Microsoft's tech.

By the way, I don't disagree with either of you as to the hassles of DRM5. I hate it too, and the implications of support and obsolescence are apparent not only in Microsoft's implementation, but others (what if Palm Digital Media decides to stop offering a Pocket PC reader, for example?). But given the current market setup, I'm not surprised nor dismayed by Microsoft's move.

--janak

[Jorgen]

>I'm not surprised nor dismayed by Microsoft's move

I don't think anybody is surprised! I just took the opportunity to air my favourite rant, preaching to the already converted. :)

I am also sure we all wish that Microsoft was just as eager to fix their other problems; I mention a few at random: memory loss in reader, PocketWord etc not as compatible as Palms Documents-to-go with MS Office, alarmclock bug in 2002 ...

Jorgen

[TawnerX]

I'll give it a month, give or take a week.

Cracking Microsoft's product security is a form of hacker sport. When will they realize that? The stronger they make it and the worst they put their attitude, the more priceless the crack become.

It's the Microsoft image that is the problem. Had the reader is done by some no name but nice lit company. The net would even help protecting and promoting the content.

[Crystal Eitle]

I guess if we are still able to read all the books we have already purchased then it is a non-issue.
This is key. If I buy a DRM protected ebook, I want to be able to read it, forever, on all of my devices. Companies like Microsoft need to grasp the concept of "I bought it - I own it." People are not very keen on "renting" content.

Why has Apple's iTunes been such a roaring success? Because they respect the customer.

[ChristopherTD]

Does this fix the memory leak problem or what?

Well the version of MS Reader in PPC2003 allegedly does fix the memory leak.

To install the security "patch" on PPC2002 you have to download the full install. It may be that after installing it we also get the latest version (and the fix) as a by-product.

However, until some other brave folk have tried out the process I won't be a guinea pig - I am a long way into my current book and don't want to find myself locked out, even for a short time.

[Jorgen]

>If I buy a DRM protected ebook, I want to be able to read it, forever, on all of my devices

Exactly! Which is why I won't be making any serious purchases in DRM5 .LIT or Palm Digital Media. I may change to a Sharp SL-C700 (http://members.rogers.com/e46m3/zaurus/ if you want to see what it looks like). Most ebooks are not even cheap.

Jorgen

[Janak Parekh]

This is key. If I buy a DRM protected ebook, I want to be able to read it, forever, on all of my devices. Companies like Microsoft need to grasp the concept of "I bought it - I own it." People are not very keen on "renting" content.
However, even more fundamentally, there is never a guarantee that DRM-protected ebooks will always be readable. Actually, there's never a guarantee any content will remain readable years and years for now. Try digging out your CP/M 8" floppy disks and reading content from that. ;)

This is more of a fundamental problem with electronic content as a whole, and we haven't solved it yet; DRM only makes it worse.

Why has Apple's iTunes been such a roaring success? Because they respect the customer.
Yes, to some extent. However (and this is an honest question) can you take that music and copy it to a PC and play it? I don't think so, but if someone knows otherwise, please let us know. I still find that a bit too restrictive for my tastes.

--janak

[ChristopherTD]

Well I took the plunge.

I backed everything up and installed the new Reader for PPC2002, and then activated it.

It opens secure books previously downloaded without any problems (though there is a noticable delay the first time). Naturally it opens non-secure content as well. I haven't tried purchasing a new book yet.

It does not seem to be just a security update, there are changes to the UI (minor) as well, so I am hoping that the memory leak is also fixed. I will report back on that when I have had a chance to page through a couple of big books. It does look like a complete new build, so here is hoping!

[ChristopherTD]

The news so far remains good. I have paged ferociously through a 1.6MB book with images and an issue of Pocket PC Magazine. Both titles had been "leakers" in the past, quickly consuming vast amounts of memory and bringing the iPaq to a halt.

The memory usage of the patched MS Reader remained fixed at about 4MB throughout all of my activity.

So a thumbs-up from me!

[Janak Parekh]

So a thumbs-up from me!
Woohoo! :D

I'll make a front-page post on it later today.

--janak

[Kevin C. Tofel]

So a thumbs-up from me!

Make it two.....installation was easy, performance is good, no issues to report....

:way to go: :way to go:

KCT

[alan williams]

Why has Apple's iTunes been such a roaring success? Because they respect the customer.
Curious, I thought it was because Apple fans eagerly lapped at whatever Jobs placed out for them. :?

Using Macs since 1985, I can honestly say that one thing that Apple no longer does is "respect" their customers.

[volwrath]

I'll give it a month, give or take a week.

Cracking Microsoft's product security is a form of hacker sport. When will they realize that? The stronger they make it and the worst they put their attitude, the more priceless the crack become.

It's the Microsoft image that is the problem. Had the reader is done by some no name but nice lit company. The net would even help protecting and promoting the content.

It took a couple of years for the initial crack to come out, so I think it may be longer than a month for it to be beat.

I disagree that its Microsoft's image.. just ask Adobe..or Apple iTunes

[Crystal Eitle]

Okay, I just went to the update site, and it says you have to uninstall the old version before you install the new one.

So I uninstalled the old one, using the add/remove programs function in Active Sync,

Then used Remover just to make sure it was really all gone...

Then when I went to install the update, it said that Reader was already installed. Huh? I went ahead with the installation anyway. I'll soon find out whether it works with new eBooks. I just find it annoying that sometimes when you remove programs, they're never really gone.

[Crystal Eitle]

Is there any way to turn off the visual guides in the latest Reader for PPC? Those are those little black triangles on either side of the page number. I don't like them and I want them gone. I can't find any way in the Settings to turn them off. Am I missing something?

[blazingwolf]

I loaded this up and so far I have had way to many problems. :( Multiple lock ups and soft resets. 8O Unlike Crystal I like the little visual guides but 1 is there and the other isn't. On the page that shows you what books you have it shows multiples of the same book even though I only have 1. Now, it is always poosible that this a conflict with some other program but I did not have these problems with the 1 that came in the ROM. Man, what a pain. Ipaq 3955.

[Janak Parekh]

On the page that shows you what books you have it shows multiples of the same book even though I only have 1.
Hmm, try deleting the ebook annotations, and see if that makes a difference? (I haven't updated yet.)

--janak

[MLO]

Having problems as well. Opening a book takes forever, much longer than it did with the prior version, and odd freezes occur in the reader.

Not sure what to think here...anyone have any similar problems? I'm going to try to delete the annotations and see what happens.

MLO

EDIT: I uninstalled Reader, cut and copied the annotation files to another location, did a soft reset and then re-installed Reader (with the soft re-set afterwards)

Still having the same problems.

[blazingwolf]

Did another soft reset and it took away the double entries but like MLO my books take forever to load too.

[Jorgen]

So, this exercise was to make MS Reader DRM5 more secure. So how long was it more secure? http://www.teleread.org/blog/2003_07_01_archive.html#105753386515429247

Now you have all lost valuable RAM in you PPC's, diskspace on your PC's and Reader is starting up slower and for what? The new DRM5 was unbreakable one week or so. LOL

Jorgen

[ChristopherTD]

Now you have all lost valuable RAM in you PPC's, diskspace on your PC's and Reader is starting up slower and for what? The new DRM5 was unbreakable one week or so.

Maybe so, but fixing the memory leak with image-rich books was worth upgrading for me. At first my books took a long time to open, but I think that is while it repaginates/reorganises the annotation file. Once that is completed the books open as fast as they ever did with the previous version (on my iPaq 5450).

I don't feel I have lost anything - and I have even gained a few free books!

[Crystal Eitle]

So, this exercise was to make MS Reader DRM5 more secure. So how long was it more secure? http://www.teleread.org/blog/2003_07_01_archive.html#105753386515429247

Now you have all lost valuable RAM in you PPC's, diskspace on your PC's and Reader is starting up slower and for what? The new DRM5 was unbreakable one week or so. LOL
I saw that article about the new DRM being cracked already. I hope this doesn't have any effect on Microsoft's free eBook promotion. I was really looking forward to all the free eBooks.

[Janak Parekh]

So, this exercise was to make MS Reader DRM5 more secure. So how long was it more secure? http://www.teleread.org/blog/2003_07_01_archive.html#105753386515429247
Sigh :? Do these folks know anything about cryptography? This isn't that hard to do securely, Microsoft... now they'll have to make us update again. :evil:

--janak

[Jorgen]

>now they'll have to make us update again

Hopefully not - a lot of people have run into problems during/after updating and wasted a lot of time.

Hopefully MS will accept that the only thing they achieved by the update, is that a whole lot more people suddenly know about Dan Jackson and his infamous convert-lit program.

However, i am glad to hear that they have fixed the memory-leak! However, I will not update just to get that fixed.

Jorgen

[davidspalding]

... Actually, there's never a guarantee any content will remain readable years and years for now. Try digging out your CP/M 8" floppy disks and reading content from that. ;)...

--janak

Oh, COME ON. Two words for you,... Project Gutenberg. Open source ebooks will be around for a lot longer than Microsoft Reader. >:)

[davidspalding]

Can confirm that new, improved Convert LIT 1.4 works fine. It, ahem, also has some fixes in it over 1.2a. Boy, that was a long wait.... >:|

I frankly think that Microsoft has effected a huge coup here -- they can tell publishers that, though .LIt files are still not fully secure, they successfully forced millions of Reader users to download new software, use up more RAM on their PDAs and go through the pain of reactivation ... on command. "Yep, those rings in our customers' snouts are working just fine. We led them around like they were trained lemmings. In fact, thanks to the Windows Update site, they ARE trained lemmings."

The free ebook promotion this summer (http://www.microsoft.com/reader/promotions/free_shop.asp) is clearly timed to coincide with the forced upgrade. Oh, well. Get your free books, and take your spoonful of mineral oil along with them.

Viva MObipocket! Viva Palm Digital Media!

[Janak Parekh]

Oh, COME ON. Two words for you,... Project Gutenberg. Open source ebooks will be around for a lot longer than Microsoft Reader. >:)
Heheh. Good call. The Internet certainly changes the notions of accessibility of old content. :)

--janak

[davidspalding]

Well ... considering all the complaints and problems I've read here and elsewhere, I sincerely hope that cheaper and more plentiful eBooks are coming.

Otherwise, the pain and suffering this forced update inflicted upon so many users was just plain arrogant. Just my opinion, naturally.

[gorkon280]

Okay, I just went to the update site, and it says you have to uninstall the old version before you install the new one.

So I uninstalled the old one, using the add/remove programs function in Active Sync,

Then used Remover just to make sure it was really all gone...

Then when I went to install the update, it said that Reader was already installed. Huh? I went ahead with the installation anyway. I'll soon find out whether it works with new eBooks. I just find it annoying that sometimes when you remove programs, they're never really gone.

I downloaded Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy from Microsoft just now and was unable to read it with the reader on WM2003's rom. Downlaoded and installed the new one and it works.

[Evee Ev]

i just bought some new books...and guess what? i can't read them with the old microsoft reader.

i'm reading here how people have upgraded to the newest version, but i'm a little stumped. i've gone to the website and i've downloaded this newer version of reader but it doesn't seem to be working.

i'm running ppc 2002, ipaq 3975. on my device it says version 2.00.1128.

what gives?! i wanna read my new books!!!

[davidspalding]

"... doesn't seem to be working." Uh-huh.

Read back in this thread, and also find the other threads about the Reader update. (Board search on keywords "reader update.") There are several common pitfalls and problems that many people have encountered. You will probably find your solution already buried in the 2-3 threads about the update. ;)