Hacking's History [Archive] - Thoughts Media Forums

Jason Dunn

01-23-2003, 11:00 AM

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,45764,00.asp' target='_blank'>http://www.pcworld.com/news/article...id,45764,00.asp</a><br /><br /></div>"1960s - The Dawn of Hacking: The first computer hackers emerge at MIT. They borrow their name from a term to describe members of a model train group at the school who "hack" the electric trains, tracks, and switches to make them perform faster and differently. A few of the members transfer their curiosity and rigging skills to the new mainframe computing systems being studied and developed on campus."<br /><br />I've never known much about Hacking, Cracking, and Phreaking, so this brief timeline was a very interesting read!

Mike Temporale

01-23-2003, 12:00 PM

They used to write code on the clubs blackboard and would hack away lines as they tried to optimize the code. Remember, back then , the smaller the better. And computing time cost big $$.

There is a great book out called "Hackers" by Steven Levy. He talks about all of this. It's a great book.

Mike Temporale

01-23-2003, 01:57 PM

oh, I forgot to add:

The reason they started working on the computers was they wanted to get the computer to control the phone switch they had hacked to switch for the model railroads.

rlobrecht

01-23-2003, 02:19 PM

There is a great book out called "Hackers" by Steven Levy. He talks about all of this. It's a great book.

I just started reading a book called Underground that is available as a free download from the author's website
http://www.underground-book.com

daS

01-23-2003, 04:57 PM

I just started reading a book called Underground that is available as a free download from the author's website
I have downloaded many things over the years, but I don't think I'd download a book about hackers from the author's website. 8O

Kati Compton

01-23-2003, 05:28 PM

There is a great book out called "Hackers" by Steven Levy. He talks about all of this. It's a great book.

That's what I get for sleeping in. Missed my chance to be cool. ;) I highly recommend that book as well.

sponge

01-23-2003, 06:07 PM

I have downloaded many things over the years, but I don't think I'd download a book about hackers from the author's website. 8O

And why's that?

i_spock

01-23-2003, 06:44 PM

That article sure took me back... I just have to share this. In 1983 I was 14 and saw Wargames in the theater. I had a TI 99/4a at the time, and coded in extended basic. After seeing that I *had* to get online! Not long after, I got a C-64, a 300 baud modem, and my own phone line. I set up my own BBS and used the handle "The Wizard". That was right around the time the 414's got busted, and I lived in Milwaukee. I remember getting a phone call late one night from a group that was in a conference call looking for the Wizard from the 414 group. I told them that wasn't me, but they let me stay on the line and listen to their conference. Wow! It was fascinating! I had been interested in phreaking and hacking but the fact that there were people doing cool stuff like this astounded me! Over the next several years I learned a lot within the phreak/hack community. Even had a visit from the secret service at my house once, but that's another story altogether. :wink:

Anyway, Wargames is probably the reason that I ultimately ended up in IT and network security. That article mentioned the Captain Crunch whistle.. I recently bought one on ebay for about 8 bucks. Cheap for a piece of hacking history! :)

daS

01-23-2003, 07:44 PM

Over the next several years I learned a lot within the phreak/hack community.
I started programming in the late ‘70’s (yeah, I’m an old geezer. :? ) I spent my time on 6502 and then PDP-11 assembly language programming but never really knew much about the hacker/phreak community. That is until after I had to fire our VAX sysop in the late 1980’s. Within a few weeks, I got a newspaper clipping faxed to me regarding that sysop. It seems that he was arrested for hacking into DEC to steal the VAX/VMS source code.

Those of you who know hackers and especially phone phreaks know I’m referring to none other than Kevin Mitnick. By the way, forget what you read in “Takedown”. If you want to read the real story, get a copy of “The fugitive Game” or if you can find it “Cyberpunks”. They describe the Kevin that I knew.

As a post script: Mitnick is now off of probation and is (what else?) a security consultant. Seeing him on TV the other day, I don’t recognize the clean-cut, slim guy for the fat slob that used to work for me. I really hope he has turned his life around. I don’t condone his actions, but the punishment he got was way out of proportion to the crimes. Not our justice system’s finest hour. :usa

i_spock

01-23-2003, 08:18 PM

Kati Compton

01-23-2003, 08:36 PM

Those of you who know hackers and especially phone phreaks know I’m referring to none other than Kevin Mitnick. By the way, forget what you read in “Takedown”. If you want to read the real story, get a copy of “The fugitive Game” or if you can find it “Cyberpunks”. They describe the Kevin that I knew.

I couldn't find Cyberpunks (out of print?), but wanted to make sure that's the full title... I found a book called Cyberpunk: Outlaws and Hackers on the Computer Frontier, by Katie Hafner, John Markoff. I don't suppose that's the book, is it?

BTW - the only fault I see with the Stephen Levy Hackers book is that the "update" to it is rather pick-and-choose. I know no one can ever cover EVERYTHING, but I ended up not reading all of it because it seemed like it was missing more than it was including for the "newer" era.

daS

01-23-2003, 09:41 PM

I couldn't find Cyberpunks (out of print?), but wanted to make sure that's the full title... I found a book called Cyberpunk: Outlaws and Hackers on the Computer Frontier, by Katie Hafner, John Markoff. I don't suppose that's the book, is it?
Yes, that's the one. John Markoff is the author of the section on Mitnick. Although it's a bit old since it was before Mitnick got caught the second (third?, well let's say last) time, Cyberpunks makes a good prefix to Littman’s book on Mitnick.

In The Fugitive Game, Littman explains how John Markoff set up a deal to make a story out of Mitnick. According to Littman, Mitnick wasn’t very hard to track down – it’s just that the FBI wasn’t very interested in the petty case. So Markoff created the persona of Mitnick the hacking genus (I can tell you he wasn’t’) and got Shimomura to go along with it based on the carrot of a book and movie deal! Markoff wrote a few stories for the NY Times, building up the case as the “supper hacker vs. the supper security expert” in a battle of wits. The truth is that every time anyone attempted to find Kevin, they did so quickly, but then couldn’t get the authorities to move in before Mitnick got spooked and escaped. It wasn't any harder for Shimomura. (Although Shimomura did use a really cool hacked cell phone connected to an HP 200LX palmtop! So that's worth something. 8) )

The Kevin Mitnick I knew was obsessed with the phone system, and was tenacious in his efforts to crack passwords, but never really was inventive in his hacking. He relied on the knowledge of others. His greatest asset (which he freely admits today) is his ability to social engineer. That is, he got access by convincing people he was someone else and they would tell him what he wanted to know! :roll:

But I can tell you that when we had VAX system problems, Kevin was lost and he would call in his buddies for help. In fact, I shared more than a few late night pizzas with Kevin, his wife Bonnie (now ex) and his friend Lenny (also ex - see below) and sometimes a few other hackers (didn’t know it at the time,) who would come by to help. Lenny was the guy that turned Kevin in to the police after his break-in at DEC. What are friends for? 8O

Still, my beef with Markoff and Shmomura isn't just that Markoff wrote the book Takedown for Shmomura, but that the newspaper reporter used the power of the NY Times to create the story so that the two of them could profit from the book and movie deal. That is more unethical than the mostly harmless antics of Kevin Mitnick. Again, Kevin certainly deserved to be punished for his crimes, but what happened to him was so out of proportion, and in large part that was due to the publicity and self promotion of Markoff and Shimomura. :?

daS

01-23-2003, 09:51 PM

Amazing! Thanks for that post..

In tech school (87-89) I learned assembly programming on a PDP-11/05 by flipping switches on the switch register. What a great way to really learn the relationship between hardware and software. I learned Fortran IV and 77 on a later generation PDP 11/xx system and system admin on a PDP running RSTS. Heh! Amazing how much programming we did, esp. since it was for a technician's degree. We even had to write the math routines of a fortran compiler.

I know what you mean about Takedown. Wasn't that written by Shimomura?
Ah, the 11/05. Great machine. I rarely had to use the front panel switches, but I did toggle in a boot program to get RT-11 to start from a paper tape once. (And only once!) :silly:

As for Takedown. Yes, Shimomura was listed as the author on the cover. (See my long winded post above.)

Sven Johannsen

01-23-2003, 10:15 PM

I started programming in the late ‘70’s (yeah, I’m an old geezer. :? )

How does that make you old, you whipper snapper. '69, high school, teletype (yes, yellow paper, paper tape punch and reader, no monitor) acoustic coupled modem and a phone you dialed (yes, round thing you stuck your finger in and turned). Some form of BASIC as I recall. Did my physics homework on it. That's back when electrons, protons and neutrons were as small as it got. Took me longer than it did the guys with the slide rules, but I had fun bringing in my answers on yellow paper:)

Wound up dealing more with the comm side (WAN), than the computers and software, but still like to play with some code when I can.

daS

01-23-2003, 10:23 PM

'69, high school, teletype (yes, yellow paper, paper tape punch and reader, no monitor) acoustic coupled modem and a phone you dialed (yes, round thing you stuck your finger in and turned).
Hey, when I started programming "base 2" hadn't been discovered. We only had "base 1" and had to program with only "0"s. :D

Seriously, I'm about 5 years your junor, but I remember Teletype model 33's and lots of papertape (EBCIDIC not ASCII).

shindullin

01-30-2003, 12:54 AM

*off topic*
That gives me an idea for an interesting poll. Wonder what the age and "background" demographics of the average Thoughts reader are. I started of progamming in basic on a commadore 64 when I was in middle school. Only that was in '85 me thinks. Ended up studying Pascal and C in high school only to major in Poli Sci instead of CompSci in college bc I couldn't handle the math...
Sometimes I wonder what would have happened if I had just buckled up...
Well, still doing fine, even with the useless degree so I can't complain. :roll:

guess that make me a zillion years DaS' junior. 8)

Kati Compton

01-30-2003, 01:16 AM

Brad Adrian

01-30-2003, 02:55 AM

Anyway, Wargames is probably the reason that I ultimately ended up in IT and network security...
My favorite 1983 movie, "The Man With Two Brains," is probably the reason I ultimately ended up slightly psychotic...

Kati Compton

01-30-2003, 08:04 AM

My favorite 1983 movie, "The Man With Two Brains," is probably the reason I ultimately ended up slightly psychotic...

Isn't anyone going to say their favorite movie and the one that got them into computers is "Weird Science"? :)

Of course, I like "Real Genius" better, myself.