iPAQ 3970 update

[Andy Sjostrom]

My move from the HP Jornada 565 to the iPAQ Pocket PC 3970 continues. I move software and settings one step at a time, and so far I am very pleased. While I would expect more speed increase from the XScale processor, I must say I am positively surprised. Perhaps that all the debate and discussions I have read and participated in set my expectations low, but this Pocket PC is by far the best performing I have ever used. If I'd pick one feature that really makes this device shine, it is the screen. This is indeed a bright star!

[Boxster S]

Glad you like it :) I personally couldn't justify the HUGE price tag of the 3970 with only the screen being a deciding factor (Bluetooth pales in comparison to 802.11b).

So when I went on the search for a PDA, I went with the e740 and the e550g as my final choices and ended up getting the e550g for $599 from CompUSA + free 64MB CF card and free 802.11b CF card.

Other than the screen what else do you like about the device?

[jngold_me]

For over $700 dollars, it had better be! Sorry, but I think HP has alot of nerve charging so much for that device, considering that Toshiba has crammed a lot more into their devices (dual slots, e740 has wiFi, 550g the 4" screen, etc).

For a non-Ipaq user looking to make the switch over to x-scale, the 3900 just doesn't make sense.

Just my .02.

[Sslixtis]

I finally gave up my Jornada 568 and went with the iPaq 3950. It was all about the screen! What an amazing screen! As far as price goes HP has a $50 Rebate on the 3900 series and $75 worth of software from Handango. And if you buy it online at CompUSA it is only $579 to start with.

With all that said, I must admit I miss the form factor (and HP Task Switcher) of my Jornada :cry: When The Pocket Solution ( http://www.thepocketsolution.com/index.htm ) finally gets their Anodized Aluminium covers ready maybe I'll be happy, that side opening cover sucks :evil: But hey, it's all about the screen anyway, so I guess I'll just deal :wink:

[porrello]

I have had several handheld devices including two Psions, three Palms, and two pocket PC. I have no doubt the IPAQ 3970 is the best machine around. It is not perfect and it is not value for money, but is the best.

Best Screen
Best Performance
Best Infrared
Best software package

and huge expandibility. There is no accesory that you can dream off that is not availablefor the IPAQ.

I run mine with a CF expansion pack with removable battery included. Bough two extra batteries and the wonderfull charger, so I can now safely say I do not worry about running out of power.

I read a lot of complaints but 99% centers around the price. Frankly if you can not afford it do not buy it!

[gmelfissg]

hi to all,

The IPAQ price even it is $579 !!! it is still too expensive for what you get. Sorry but a screen doesn't deserve that much pricing because the important thing is what you can do with it. Yes the IPAQ is expendable but the e740 is also righ now 599$ at compusa + free bluetooth cf card. you can also have for 99$ a vga port and usb port. Also you can have and additional bationnary hook to the pocket pc (3000 amp) and also a pmcia sleeve will be offered shortly plus you can use a cf-pmicia adapter for $25 which work very fine.

So sorry if i disagree but paying that much for a screen, i'll pass the toshiba e-740 is by far the better device (perfromance, value and quality).

Giuseppe Melfi :lol:

[post edited by moderator for niceness]

[ojlittle]

I've had a 3955 for about a month & I love it. However, two nights ago it lost my iPAQ file store memory, and now it takes 5 minutes to recover from a hard reset (no exaggeration). My file store memory is gone even after a hard reset.

There is good news though. I contacted HP/Compaq & they said they would send me a box, I'd send it in, they would fix it or replace it. Not bad... It gets better though. A Compaq rep from Texas called today out of the blue & said he had a brand new one at their location & would send me that one, box still factory sealed. It's supposed to be here tomorrow morning. All I have to do is send them the old one at my convenience.......Great customer service.

Wasn't there a problem with some of the older Compaq units losing their file store memory? I know one of the brands did, but I don't remember which.

[sponge]

I've been considering a 3900 (as I have a 3600 already, plus cf sleeve and case) but can't decide between the e550G and the Zayo.. might go for the Zayo but no CF! ARGH!

So I'm hopelessly stuck right now.. though I think I've ruled out the e550.

[jngold_me]

Wasn't there a problem with some of the older Compaq units losing their file store memory? I know one of the brands did, but I don't remember which.

I have had this happen to me on a Jornada 567 and have heard that it also affects Ipaqs. Personally, I think it occurs when the filestore reaches some sort of size limit or when something gets corrupted when writing to that area of memory. Anyways, I don't think it is a device specific (obviously, since it has 2 vendor devices) problem.

Cheers!

I read a lot of complaints but 99% centers around the price. Frankly if you can not afford it do not buy it!

Quite frankly, I can afford it but that isn't quite the point now, is it?

[cwharper]

So, is the Xscale based model any faster? A gentleman at work was saying that even though the processor is twice as fast, something about the way the memory is being accessed actually was twice as slow, so you ended up with the same performance as the older models...

[EricMCarson]

(Bluetooth pales in comparison to 802.11b).

What is it with you people that think Bluetooth competes with 802.11b? Do you just not get it? Bluetooth is designed for cable elimination in short-range environments, while 802.11b is a long-range network replacement. Who would ever connect a phone to their network? Or a headset? The 3970 doesn't include 802.11b in my opinion because it is designed to be a "portable" device. Those of us on the go love bluetooth because it allows us to be completely "portable". If we need network access with a "portable" device, we'll get an add-on. Personally, I believe bluetooth to be the significant wireless access protocol for truly portable devices (extremely low power consumption), while 802.11b will be relegated to machines that need to move within a specific network (i.e., in an office environment from one location in the office to another).

BTW, the 3970 screen is worth the significant price tag. Until you've seen the screen, you'll never understand the device. It is awesome!

[sponge]

XScale is faster, a lot faster in some cases. 56FPS in PocketTV (confirmed on the Zayo)

[Foo Fighter]

If I'd pick one feature that really makes this device shine, it is the screen. This is indeed a bright star!

That's it, keep rubbing it in my face! :wink:

[Eos]

(Bluetooth pales in comparison to 802.11b).

What is it with you people that think Bluetooth competes with 802.11b? Do you just not get it? Bluetooth is designed for cable elimination in short-range environments, while 802.11b is a long-range network replacement.
BTW, the 3970 screen is worth the significant price tag. Until you've seen the screen, you'll never understand the device. It is awesome!

One couldn't explain this better. Personally, I don't like the idea of the PkPC phone ("all egs in one basket"...and all that). I am not hysteric about 802.11b either, as my PkPC which is never more than a handlength far away from me, was never intended to replace my Thinkpad. But, when I really am in some S...ty hole, and all I have there is my 3970 and T-39, I like the ability to do what I have to do, as transparently (cableless) as can be. BlueTooth and Wireless Lan, may share the definition "Wireless Comm. Technologies" but they are meant for different targets. And BTW, the 39xx screen, is (for the time being and IMHO) THE thing. Pricewise, well I would like to actually get it from HP - for FREE. But otherwise, I exploit the expense to the utmost !

[Nikhil]

Real life performance of the iPAQ 39xx is better than the e740. Having owned both devices, I can say my iPAQ 3970's quality is much better than the e740 that i owned. No creaking, no bugs...it works as it should (as previous iPAQs should have). :roll:

[xnovax]

I've been using the 3970 for a month (I moved up from a 3650) and have no regrets about the purchase. I added bluetooth to my Dell Latitude and my Powerbook and the whole thing makes for a slick little Personal Area Network. My only disappointment is not having access to a Bluetooth enabled phone just yet. The phones with Bluetooth aren't quite supported in the local area. It'll get there.

[Ed Hansberry]

(Bluetooth pales in comparison to 802.11b).

What is it with you people that think Bluetooth competes with 802.11b? Do you just not get it? Bluetooth is designed for cable elimination in short-range environments, while 802.11b is a long-range network replacement. Who would ever connect a phone to their network?
I agree, but tell that to Palm. They just put in a BT LAN in their corporate office. :roll: Obviously lots of people think BT competes with 802.11b. In fact, http://www.pico.net/ has built a business around it.

[that_kid]

I've had my 3970 for a litle over a month now and I agree with everyone that it's what the other ipaqs should have been from the start. I've had every Ipaq "Revision" and my 3970 is great, I was able to trade up from my 3835 so this made it a no braineer. I did look at the E740 for a good while but I like the expandability of the ipaq. The only problem that I've found with my 3970 is beaming to a palm but a call to HP fixed that (in 2 weeks very impressive). The next rom update will have the ir fix and now I am quite happy. I'm using an ambicom bluetooth card that is jus horrible in my laptop with xp. I'm going to get a socket card cause I hear that they work great and are very low profile. Now add the great screen and all the streaming that I do and you have a winner.

[don dre]

I still own a 3630, albeit upgraded to 64mb per Linear Logix, with a CF Plus Sleeve, 1 Gb Microdrive, and (as of last night) a D-Link Cf 802.11b card. As for Bluetooth, I am very interested in i but it has yet to deliver on its promises. so far there si only one phone (to my knowledge) that lets you take advantage of it. Perhsps a keyboard. With that said, with my 802.11b card I can control my mp3's remotely via Remote Amp. Also, there are an increasing number of hotspots around me (I think if you live in a city this may be more likely). They do compete to a certani extent but the true purpose of bluetooth is the elmination of cables. owever, $750 is a lot of money for a screen and a technology that has yet to be proven. I saw the e740 for $480! $750 is to much for any screen and bluetooth. The whole point of bluetooth was that it was supposed to be cheap. So, for others who don't have as much cash for toys as they would like, I have decided on more expansion to get me through until the next line when we finally see something truly different...and perhaps cheap. Maybe even a significant speed increase.

[Boxster S]

I still own a 3630, albeit upgraded to 64mb per Linear Logix, with a CF Plus Sleeve, 1 Gb Microdrive, and (as of last night) a D-Link Cf 802.11b card. As for Bluetooth, I am very interested in i but it has yet to deliver on its promises. so far there si only one phone (to my knowledge) that lets you take advantage of it. Perhsps a keyboard. With that said, with my 802.11b card I can control my mp3's remotely via Remote Amp. Also, there are an increasing number of hotspots around me (I think if you live in a city this may be more likely). They do compete to a certani extent but the true purpose of bluetooth is the elmination of cables. owever, $750 is a lot of money for a screen and a technology that has yet to be proven. I saw the e740 for $480! $750 is to much for any screen and bluetooth. The whole point of bluetooth was that it was supposed to be cheap. So, for others who don't have as much cash for toys as they would like, I have decided on more expansion to get me through until the next line when we finally see something truly different...and perhaps cheap. Maybe even a significant speed increase.

Exactly, 802.11b is SO much more compatible on every front. And 802.11b is dirt cheap these days. You can walk into a Starbucks and have a connection. I'd say close to 75% of college campuses have 802.11b campus wide. I know here at NC State, we have 802.11b all over the place including the library and in most of the engineering classrooms. Other campuses here in NC including UNC, Duke, and Wake Forest are also 802.11b "hot."

Bluetooth is in a niche market right now and I don't think that it will ever take off. There just isn't enough product support for it, and from what I've read, setup and connections via Bluetooth are flaky at best. Also, the extremely short range is very limiting.

As for the expandibility word that people keep on throwing out for the iPAQ. The e740 and e550g BOTH have dual slots. I don't think there are many peripherals that you can't get get in CF Type-II that you have to use a sleeve for to use on the iPAQ serious. Plus, it doesn't add even MORE thickness and weight.

[Boxster S]

And as for everyone claiming how fast the 3900 is, it (along with the e740) gets stomped by the new Asus A600 (smallest and lightest PocketPC) not to mention that the Asus is much lighter and comes with a CF sleeve with battery pack, mini USB cable, and CF to PCMCIA Adaptor for $599 ($499 without all the frills). So much for that "uber" iPAQ :lol: The A600 makes the iPAQ 3900 look ridiculously overpriced (which it is).

http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=112&mode=&order=0&thold=0

http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=115&mode=&order=0&thold=0

Standard Edition:

A600 Pocket PC
Sync Cable
AC Adaptor
Sleeve case
Companion CD
Manual
Quick Start Guide
Troubeshooting Guide
Warranty Card
$549 for the Standard Edition ($50 rebate thru 12/32/02) or $499.
Executive Edition:

A600 Pocket PC
Mini USB Sync Cable
AC Adaptor
Portable Cradle
Jacket with CF slot & Built-in Battery
Desk Holder (not sure what this is)
Sleeve Case
CF to PCMCIA Adaptor
Companion CD
Manual
Quick Start Guide
Troubleshooting Guide
Warranty Card
$649 for the Executive Edition ($50 rebate thru 12/31/02) or $599.
Also, here is a list of other accessories, most of which will be available at launch (not sure if I can mention the launch date, but I will check):

Here is a list of the other accessories, most of which will be available at launch.

CF Jacket for A600 w/battery built-in Portable Keyboard for A600, Semi transparent
Battery Bank 3600mAh W/AC Adaptor (universal)
Cradle with mini USB Sync. Cable
Universal Memory Card Reader & Storage Device (20G)
Car Charger
Traveling Sync. Cable
CF to PCMCIA Adaptor
Zayo Styli (3 Pk)
Zayo Desk Stand with Stylus
Zayo 1.3 Megapixel CF VGA Digital Camera
Zayo Mini CF Scanner

[Jonathon Watkins]

What is it with you people that think Bluetooth competes with 802.11b? Do you just not get it? Bluetooth is designed for cable elimination in short-range environments, while 802.11b is a long-range network replacement.
Don't forget though that Class 1 Bluetooth has a range of 100 meters. That's really now bad at all. I would personally prefer a class 1 Bluetooth PPC connection to a WiFi connection. It's less power hungry and more secure.

I agree with the comments on the 39xx screen. I did not believe how good it was till I viewed one side by side with a LOOX. Wow. I will wait for the next generation of devices when all PPC will hopefully have one of these beauties. (I will NOT every buy and IPAQ though).

[Boxster S]

What is it with you people that think Bluetooth competes with 802.11b? Do you just not get it? Bluetooth is designed for cable elimination in short-range environments, while 802.11b is a long-range network replacement.
Don't forget though that Class 1 Bluetooth has a range of 100 meters. That's really now bad at all. I would personally prefer a class 1 Bluetooth PPC connection to a WiFi connection. It's less power hungry and more secure.

I agree with the comments on the 39xx screen. I did not believe how good it was till I viewed one side by side with a LOOX. Wow. I will wait for the next generation of devices when all PPC will hopefully have one of these beauties. (I will NOT every buy and IPAQ though).

But the 3900 isn't Class-1 is it? What IS the range on the iPAQ?

[Jonathon Watkins]

I believe that the IPAQ is class 2 (10 meters). The LOOX is class 1 (100 meters) and I don't know of any PDAs that are class 3 (1 meter).

[Will T Smith]

(Bluetooth pales in comparison to 802.11b).

What is it with you people that think Bluetooth competes with 802.11b? Do you just not get it? Bluetooth is designed for cable elimination in short-range environments, while 802.11b is a long-range network replacement. Who would ever connect a phone to their network?
I agree, but tell that to Palm. They just put in a BT LAN in their corporate office. :roll: Obviously lots of people think BT competes with 802.11b. In fact, http://www.pico.net/ has built a business around it.

The access point they have posted is very intruiging. I would be interested to see a real world review regarding it's viability in a Home/Home office space.

The advertisement claims 10x Bluetooth range. That would be 100 Meters, well over 300 feet. Taking into account the low power requirements for Bluetooth nodes, this would be truly impressive, and VERY much preferred due to increased wire time and REAL security.

When this thing gets down to the $300 level, sign me up.

[Jonathon Watkins]

Will - what they claim is:Key Features and Benefits
• Extended Range. PicoBlue provides wireless access to low-power Bluetooth client devices such as handhelds from as far as 300 feet (100m) and to high-power Bluetooth client devices such as notebooks from as far as 800 feet (250m) in open areas. Indoors, typical range is between 50 (10m) and 150 feet (45m).
So they are claiming 1x bluetooth range (class 1) (though 10x class 2). However bluetooth works on the basis of the lowered powered unit. Ie. class 2 IPAQ with Class 1 transmiter still only gets you 10 meters.

You can get more in open area of course.

[don dre]

Bluetooth is taking its sweet ass time. It has potential but timing is also improtatn. New TI chips for WiFi consume much less power. The D-Link Air Plus are cheaper than reg. 802.11 and use less power. Just saying that the unregulated airwaves are startign to take off. I'm sure the fact that the FCC doesn't have it's grubby hands all over it has something to do with its success. BT is great for headphones and headsets, phones talking to pda's, etc. But the price is ridiculous. $200 for a headset? As for the ipaq, I too like its expandability but it still seems to me none fo the ppc's get the mix just right. We can only hope for the next round...

[Duncan]

That's very USAcentric thinking. I have a Bluetooth headset, PC dongle, laptop, PDA and printer all nicely paired and connected - easy as pie to use! The rest of the world does not hang around simply because a technology has yet to take off in the States (note GPRS and GSM digital mobile phone networks, along with emergent 'true' 3G tech, leaving the US in the dust as far as mobile technology goes)!

BT and WiFi will continue to co-exist (and I strongly deny the notion that WiFi is more mature than BT) and even merge. There are already two access points available (and one coming) that allow BT access to WiFi networks - the best of both worlds.

BTW - real world ranges of BT (roughly measured) for the Loox = 40 metres; for the iPAQ 3970 = 20 metres; for the Toshiba e740 - approx. 5 metres (but bugger all use as it refused point blank to do anything!). Also - the Sony Vaio and Tecom BT dongle manage 40 metres - for obvious reasons I can't say whether either of them, or the Loox, can achieve more!

[msd]

I'm a bit late to this string but in case anyone is still listening I thought it might be worth explaining a little bit about Bluetooth range (actually, any wireless technology's range).

A common misperception is that range between two devices is a function of their transmit or output power and that the the lower-powered device dictates the range. If that were the case, then your cell phone would never be able to make a connection to cellular base station (tower). So there's another component. That component is known as receiver sensitivity (measured in dBm). To use an aural analogy, transmit power is akin to a device's ability to "yell." Receiver sensitivity is akin to a device's ability to "hear." Range is determined by the weaker of these two links. When both devices can hear each other yell, that's referred to as a balanced link.

So in Bluetooth, even a low-powered class 3 device -- which typically has a range of 10 meters to other class 3 devices -- can have much greater range if the device to which is speaking, such as an access point, has enhanced receiver sensitivity (e.g. enhanced hearing capability) as well as sufficient output power to yell back to the class 3 device. So if we assume that an access point is a Class 1 device, then the greater its receiver sensitivity, the greater the effective range of all devices that are connecting to it.

This is why you could see a range of up to 100 meters for class 3 devices or even higher for class 1 client devices. Of course, enhancing receiver sensitivity costs money, hence the difference in quoted ranges from different vendors.

I hope this has been helpful.

[Jonathon Watkins]

I hope this has been helpful.
Yes, extremely. :D Welcome to the party and happy posting! It's good to have you join us. :D

You learn something new every day. :wink: