Log in

View Full Version : Simple is what you call yourself


Andy Sjostrom
08-14-2002, 02:05 AM
when you don't have much to offer. That was the anti-Palm Pocket PC slogan a couple of years ago. In short, the same slogan can be used to summarize <a href="http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/article/0,aid,102519,pg,1,00.asp">PC World's Buyer's Guide</a>. "If you simply need to maintain an up-to-date appointment calendar, contact list, and to-do list when you are away from your PC, your best bet is to stick with Palm OS devices."<br /><br />Seriously, I think the article is a good read and does a pretty job in explaining the different PDA options on the market today. The article's unspoken statement is "Pocket PC for strength. Palm for simplicity".

Ed Hansberry
08-14-2002, 02:23 AM
Oh give me a break.
If you simply need to maintain an up-to-date appointment calendar, contact list, and to-do list when you are away from your PC, your best bet is to stick with Palm OS devices. Their easy-to-use data synchronization stands out. However, Pocket PC devices handle PC-like apps better while still offering conventional scheduling and contact synchronization. But this higher functionality can add up to a more complex system to master.
I have actually heard more problems with how Palm syncs data in limitations of the HotSync software. Syncing documents usually requires a conduit and you need to press a button to ensure your device is up to date. I'll grant you that when ActiveSync doesn't work, it can be a pain to troubleshoot, but it usually works fine from document conversion, email attachment configuration and seamless Avantgo syncing.

JonnoB
08-14-2002, 02:36 AM
I miss syncronizing my Palm. I wish I could have a button to push to sync my Pocket PC. I think auto-syncing is idiotic and one should be forced to push a button to get the job done. :P

Kidding aside, I do agree that the Palm is simplistic and because it is so simplistic, a perfect match for those with simple organizing needs. If the Palm fanatics or anti-MS crowd could get over the Microsoft envy/hatred, they would see that as soon as they outgrow their Palm, a Pocket PC is an awesome platform to graduate to. This article eludes to that very well.

Brad Adrian
08-14-2002, 02:53 AM
...I think auto-syncing is idiotic and one should be forced to push a button to get the job done...

First of all, I think we need a new emoticon for indicating absolute sarcasm like this! Second, this is a "feature" of Palm devices that I will never understand. Whenever I leave my office, it's usually at the last minute that I grab my Pocket PC, so I am always SOOOO glad we've got the ability to synch continuously. Is there some benefit to the pushbutton method that I'm missing?

Ed Hansberry
08-14-2002, 03:12 AM
...I think auto-syncing is idiotic and one should be forced to push a button to get the job done...

First of all, I think we need a new emoticon for indicating absolute sarcasm like this!

http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm1.gif http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm2.gif http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm3.gif

I like the third one personally. Looks like someone about to bust out laughing.

And Brad - button pushing is Zen. Autosync is bloat. Say that tonight as you drift off to sleep. http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm3.gif

Jeff Rutledge
08-14-2002, 04:26 AM
If the Palm fanatics or anti-MS crowd could get over the Microsoft envy/hatred, they would see that as soon as they outgrow their Palm, a Pocket PC is an awesome platform to graduate to. This article eludes to that very well.

I can personally attest to this. I've been a happy iPAQ user for 2 years (3650 to 3870) after having 3 Palm's, the last being a Vx. At the time, I really liked my Palm's and got a great deal of use out of them.

I'm now on the project team evaluating a possible mobile/wireless solution for my company. As part of that, I've forced myself to give up my iPAQ and use a Palm m515 as my primary device. Well, I lasted about 3 weeks. Now I'm using both. I am still using the m515 as it's still in contention (for a variety of factors...but that's another story) and I have to, but it's the iPAQ I bring home every night. :wink:

Having enjoyed the PPC O/S for a while now, I find the Palm O/S very difficult to go back to. It seems like I've stepped back a generation or two. So while I agree that the Palm O/S is the "keep it simple" solution, I think it should be added that it would be very difficult to go back to after "mastering the more complex system."

Still, bottom line for me at this point is that, until the PPC gets a wireless solution that keeps the form factor small, Blackberry's will rule the Enterprise.

Then again, maybe it's just me. 8)

Jimmy Dodd
08-14-2002, 01:41 PM
...I think auto-syncing is idiotic and one should be forced to push a button to get the job done...

First of all, I think we need a new emoticon for indicating absolute sarcasm like this!

http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm1.gif http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm2.gif http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm3.gif

I like the third one personally. Looks like someone about to bust out laughing.



I think the first one is best. The third one looks like its getting ready to hurl.

---
Bwana Jim

JMountford
08-14-2002, 02:22 PM
I love Pocket PCs, but first and formost I LOVE technology. I can not even imagine what my home would look like if I was able to afford all of the goodies I want. What I am getting at, is that even though I LOVE PPC, it is not the best solution for everyone. WE (PPC users) tend to forget that. The best solution is whateveer is right for the individual user.

Ed Hansberry
08-14-2002, 02:28 PM
I love Pocket PCs, but first and formost I LOVE technology. I can not even imagine what my home would look like if I was able to afford all of the goodies I want. What I am getting at, is that even though I LOVE PPC, it is not the best solution for everyone. WE (PPC users) tend to forget that. The best solution is whateveer is right for the individual user.
I agree partially. The best solution is the one that works for you. However, it isn't generally the PPC side that forgets it. Most PPC users get vocal when people start yelling "Zen" and "Bloat" and say you must be simple (simplistic) and then go out and spend $500 on a Sony so you can have music and decent color screen, but still lack so many other things native to the Pocket PC - good email, MS Reader, common sense file system, voice recording, etc.

It is generally the Palm audience that demands you use Palm because you shouldn't have more needs than a Palm can provide. :roll:

JMountford
08-14-2002, 02:50 PM
Could it be Ed that people are just Stupid in general? Maybe we as humans are not happy unless we are finding fault with something else. Maybe our lives are so normally uneventful that we must cause drama where ever we can. And it is all more a human condition than what OS is better.

Sorry, Kind of a rant there, but I think it is always silly to argue about silly things. I think people should go with whatever makes them happy. I truly love my iPaq, (I would really like a new one, but alas). I can't say how many post its I used to have around. To me it is more than an organizer it has become my security blanket. I can just pick up my PPC and do whatever I feel like doing at that moment. That is why it works for me.

As far as Palm users being the main source of trouble in the two camps. I would tend to agree. Simple people like simple things. These are also the people that do not understand why a person would want a flatscreen tv and dvd. What can you do?

More often than not I have swayed a Palm user to PPC if they were interested in the Sony line.

BertBert
08-14-2002, 03:04 PM
Just yesterday I ordered a Toshiba e310 as an upgrade for my aging Visor Deluxe. I've been a Palm OS user since 1998 but decided to make the switch to PPC because, of all things, I found PPC easier to deal with, or one might say "simpler", than PalmOS. (Also, that Amazon.com deal was just too good to pass up!)

On one level -- namely that of the basic PIM functions and nothing more -- PalmOS is a little simpler than PPC, meaning that on average there are slightly fewer commands to perform to do basic things. But the moment you want to go deeper than the basics, for example editing files and transferring back and forth between the PC and the handheld, I found that PalmOS becomes tremendously complicated. Ironically it's the "simplicity" of the PalmOS architecture (for example, its lack of file and directory structure) that makes a lot of these sorts of things difficult. When I edit a file on the Palm, all I want to do is save it under a certain file name in a certain directory. How hard of a request is that? And yet it's not the sort of thing you can just do on a Palm. One has to make a sort of Frankenstein's monster out of the device with the third-party software just to make the thing behave like a normal computer. Having a handheld that actually speaks more or less the same language as a PC seems to make life much easier. Perhaps OS5 will fix this, but then again where are the OS5 devices? And how expensive are they going to be?

So I think this whole "Palm is simpler than PPC" argument has some truth to it, but it is highly relative, and one could easily argue the same thing in favor of PPC. I don't begrudge anybody the right to prefer PalmOS over PPC, and more power to you if you can do the sorts of things I had problems with. But for me the whole "simplicity" idea swung in exactly the opposite direction than the Palm people usually indicate.

JMountford
08-14-2002, 04:30 PM
Well BertBert welcome to the Pocket PC may your day be merry and bright, and all of your Christmas's be white.

And you'll live happily ever after. Next step is an Xscale machine.

Charles Pickrell
08-14-2002, 05:47 PM
What turned me of most abuout the article is that they still are listing PowerPoint as a core application on Pocket PC. I just shows that they don't know what they are taling about.

fundmgr90210
08-14-2002, 05:48 PM
I agree partially. The best solution is the one that works for you. However, it isn't generally the PPC side that forgets it. Most PPC users get vocal when people start yelling "Zen" and "Bloat" and say you must be simple (simplistic) and then go out and spend $500 on a Sony so you can have music and decent color screen, but still lack so many other things native to the Pocket PC - good email, MS Reader, common sense file system, voice recording, etc.

It is generally the Palm audience that demands you use Palm because you shouldn't have more needs than a Palm can provide. :roll:

I'd look at it from another direction: I also wanted items like music, hi-res color, good email, common sense file system, good quality e-book programs, etc. That is why I tried PPC for over a year. Unfortunately, I found that the hardware and software couldn't really execute these things effectively, making me frustrated and feeling like it was more trouble than it was worth (resets, memory management, dead batteries, hardware quality issues, sync problems, etc.)

Then the Sonys came along and provided all these things but still had the reliable, stable, battery and sync friendly Palm OS platform. For all the stereotypes PPC users get thrown at them, there's a new one (well, maybe it's not that new) being leveled at Palm users: that Palm units can't be powerful. For instance, nothing in the PPC camp can handle office documents like the current Documents to Go.

With OS 5.0 incorporating hi-res, faster processors, d-pad, stereo sound, etc. there will be a lot more Palm OS choices than simply Sony for power users.

Jeff Rutledge
08-14-2002, 05:50 PM
What turned me of most abuout the article is that they still are listing PowerPoint as a core application on Pocket PC. I just shows that they don't know what they are taling about.

Yeah I noticed that too. Maybe they were just lazy. Rather than getting into "you can do PPT with 3rd party apps...blah blah blah" they just said you could do it. Actually, I just read it again...they missed the boat. Good Call. :)

dunneldeen
08-14-2002, 07:35 PM
...I think auto-syncing is idiotic and one should be forced to push a button to get the job done...

First of all, I think we need a new emoticon for indicating absolute sarcasm like this!

http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm1.gif http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm2.gif http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/sarcasm3.gif

I like the third one personally. Looks like someone about to bust out laughing.



I think the first one is best. The third one looks like its getting ready to hurl.

---
Bwana Jim

I didn't notice it before, but you're right. It does look like the third icon wants to hurl.

GregWard
08-15-2002, 12:02 AM
I'm now on the project team evaluating a possible mobile/wireless solution for my company. As part of that, I've forced myself to give up my iPAQ and use a Palm m515 as my primary device. Well, I lasted about 3 weeks. Now I'm using both.

Having been in a similar position I think this sums it up perfectly. I needed to evaluate "pocket" devices for use in collecting market research data. I went Palm every time. Why - 'cos they're simple! Not that much for the Respondents to foul up (!!!) and dead easy to programme.

Do I use one myself any more? No way! They're too simple! :D

Jeff Rutledge
08-15-2002, 12:09 AM
Do I use one myself any more? No way! They're too simple! :D

That sums it up perfectly. The question for me is a simple one. The question for our users is a little more difficult. I find myself jumping from one side of the fence to the other on a regular basis. The next couple months will be interesting to say the least.