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View Full Version : TRV460 -- Output to VCDs quality


Don Tolson
03-03-2004, 09:38 PM
I bought a Sony TRV460, mainly because it was the only camera I could find locally that would read my old 8mm tapes. I'm hoping to use the USB streaming output to my computer to use the camera to transfer the old tapes to VCD (or DVD, if I can find a reasonably priced burner).

Question is, will the VCD format be of similar quality to that of the 8mm tapes? (I know it can't get any better, but I'm worried about degredation...)

Thanks.

/drt

Jason Dunn
03-04-2004, 01:15 AM
Hi Don! Couple of things...

1) USB won't work. You'll be doing Firewire - I know, it's confusing for a computer guy. When I first started with a Firewire camera I thought that because it had a USB cable that was the way to transfer video. ;-)

2) You do not want to go VCD - the quality will be horrific. VCD quality is, frankly, not all that great. It's because the bit rate is so low. You want to go DVD with this - trust me on that. $111 CND will get you one of these: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/Category/category_tlc.asp?CatId=4

You might also consider keeping digital archives. With some of my older home videos that I don't really need on DVD, I use the Windows Media Encoder to create a 720 x 480, 2000 kbps video archive that looks great on a computer. ;-)

Don Tolson
03-04-2004, 08:07 PM
Ok, so I should upgrade/add a DVD burner to my desktop -- I hear ya..., and I'll pick up a i-Link (i.e. Firewire cable) for my camera. Fortunately, the desktop already has a firewire connection.

Now with the digital 'archive', WME creates a file? Do I just store this on my computer for reading with WME later? Are the files smaller than what would be stored on a DVD?

Jason Dunn
03-04-2004, 09:28 PM
Now with the digital 'archive', WME creates a file? Do I just store this on my computer for reading with WME later? Are the files smaller than what would be stored on a DVD?

You'd first need to capture the video file to your computer. I capture the DV-AVI using Pinnacle Studio 8, add a title and some simple transitions, then output it again as an AVI file. Then you take that AVI file and convert it into the File Archive WMV file.

Don Tolson
03-12-2004, 08:02 AM
$111 CND will get you one of these: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/Category/category_tlc.asp?CatId=4


Was there a particular model you were thinking of? Prices have probably changed since you posted this, but none of them are $111 CDN.

Jason Dunn
03-12-2004, 05:39 PM
Was there a particular model you were thinking of? Prices have probably changed since you posted this, but none of them are $111 CDN.

Well, there's this 4x -R burner from Toshiba for $97.99:

http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=235700&Sku=C26-1128

If money is no object, this is the one to get:
http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=615101&Sku=P67-1064

This might be your best bet for a combo drive that's affordable ($119.99 after rebate):
http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=33761&Sku=I800-3004

Don Tolson
03-12-2004, 07:57 PM
2) You do not want to go VCD - the quality will be horrific. VCD quality is, frankly, not all that great. It's because the bit rate is so low.


In your book, you seem quite taken with the VCD and SVCD formats...Is the change in heart because of the change in technologies and availability of DVD burners now? Or has something else happened?

Jason Dunn
03-12-2004, 08:08 PM
In your book, you seem quite taken with the VCD and SVCD formats...Is the change in heart because of the change in technologies and availability of DVD burners now? Or has something else happened?

Good catch! It really depends on what you're using them for. Burning a quick VCD/SVCD is fine for a vacation photo slideshow with music, but you were talking about archiving old memories - to me, that means that quality is the #1 concern, and DVD would be the only way to go IMO. VCD/SVCD each have their uses, but when it comes to permanently archiving memories, I only recommend the absolute highest quality. VCD is actually not too bad if there's not a lot of motion - once you capture the footage, you might want to do an experiment to see what you think.

Don Tolson
03-12-2004, 09:54 PM
You hit it right on the head. I'm looking to permanently store old memories (kids first birthdays, etc.) so I do want quality. I'm going to order the Pinnacle software and DVD burner today.

Hope the burner isn't too difficult to install... :confused totally: (for those of us who have become technically challenged over the years.)

Thanks for the help, Jason.

Montego
03-18-2004, 01:00 PM
Hi Don! Couple of things...

1) USB won't work. You'll be doing Firewire - I know, it's confusing for a computer guy. When I first started with a Firewire camera I thought that because it had a USB cable that was the way to transfer video.

Actually, on a Digital 8 camera the USB port is the only way to capture analog 8mm tapes to the PC. direct from the camera. Most D8 cameras include a firewire and USB port. The Sony software allows for transferring the Analog 8 tapes through USB. Of course, the firewire port is to transfer D8 tapes.

I

Jason Dunn
03-18-2004, 06:29 PM
Actually, on a Digital 8 camera the USB port is the only way to capture analog 8mm tapes to the PC. direct from the camera. Most D8 cameras include a firewire and USB port. The Sony software allows for transferring the Analog 8 tapes through USB. Of course, the firewire port is to transfer D8 tapes.

Really? So the camera has USB 2.0? There's no way you could do 720 x 480 resolution over USB 1.1. I don't have a Digital 8 camera, so it's not like I can test this, but that sounds incorrect somehow... :?

Don Tolson
03-18-2004, 06:51 PM
Yes, the camera has USB 2.0. Thanks for the heads up, Montego. I've only tried downloading D8 tapes, not the analog 8mm ones yet.

Jason Dunn
03-18-2004, 07:20 PM
Yes, the camera has USB 2.0. Thanks for the heads up, Montego. I've only tried downloading D8 tapes, not the analog 8mm ones yet.

Ah, interesting. But what about two years ago? Did they always come with USB 2.0? That just seems so utterly strange to me - I wonder why Sony went that route? Does the camera have an "analogue" mode where it doesn't output via Firewire?

Montego
03-18-2004, 07:31 PM
I've got an older TRV 740 D8 camera which is about two years old. I believe the USB port on my camera is 1.1, which explains why the capturing of analog 8 tapes was spotty for me. I had better luck just hooking the audio/video out of my analog 8 camera and recording directly on to the D8 camera (the TRV 740 has Video input capability). Then I just transferred normally thorugh firewire. After tweaking the catpured vid in Vegas it came out looking pretty good.


The main reason for USB 1.1 on the camera was to transfer from the memory stick. Plus you can use the camera as a live web cam with USB. I never really wanted to use an $800 camera as a webcam. :)

Jason Dunn
03-18-2004, 07:44 PM
I've got an older TRV 740 D8 camera which is about two years old. I believe the USB port on my camera is 1.1, which explains why the capturing of analog 8 tapes was spotty for me.

No doubt! That would explain a lot. ;-)

The main reason for USB 1.1 on the camera was to transfer from the memory stick. Plus you can use the camera as a live web cam with USB. I never really wanted to use an $800 camera as a webcam. :)

Absolutely - with every MiniDV camera that I've seen, the USB is strictly for transferring photos from the SD card, or using it as a Web cam. That's why I was shocked that Sony would use USB for transferring analogue - seems like the wrong solution to the problem.

Thanks for teaching me something new! :-)

Don Tolson
03-18-2004, 08:06 PM
If I get a chance over the weekend, I'll give the USB a try on the 460 and let you know the results.

Don Tolson
03-25-2004, 07:31 AM
OK, I've now confirmed that on the TRV460, output from analog tapes (8mm, Hi8) is available from the firewire port for capture, etc. I guess the camera is doing analog-digital conversion on the fly.

I haven't been able to get any video output from the USB port yet. I probably have a setting wrong, so I'll take another look at the manual tonight.

I'm really pleased with the quality of video capture from my old tapes.

Jason Dunn
03-25-2004, 05:08 PM
OK, I've now confirmed that on the TRV460, output from analog tapes (8mm, Hi8) is available from the firewire port for capture, etc. I guess the camera is doing analog-digital conversion on the fly.

Ok, that's normal and in line with what other cameras do. :-)

I haven't been able to get any video output from the USB port yet. I probably have a setting wrong, so I'll take another look at the manual tonight.

But if you're getting the video via Firewire, why do you need it via USB? I'll take Firewire over USB any day. ;-)

Don Tolson
03-25-2004, 07:15 PM
But if you're getting the video via Firewire, why do you need it via USB? I'll take Firewire over USB any day. ;-)

...just to a) see if it will do it; and b) confirm that it's USB 2.0 and what bandwidth/resolutions it will support. -- just in case I come to a computer (like my laptop) that doesn't have a firewire port!

Jason Dunn
03-26-2004, 12:07 AM
...just to a) see if it will do it; and b) confirm that it's USB 2.0 and what bandwidth/resolutions it will support. -- just in case I come to a computer (like my laptop) that doesn't have a firewire port!

Aha! Ok, those are worthy goals. :-D

Don Tolson
03-26-2004, 02:01 AM
...and I happen to have a bit of a 'geek streak' which likes to play with stuff and see what it can do....

"Read the Manual??? Not on your life!! It should be intuitive!!!" :wink: